Episode 14: Why Outdoor Enthusiasts Love Fall

Mary Herendeen:

Hiking, climbing, fishing, and more. There's so much you can do in the great outdoors. Autumn is just around the corner, and this is a perfect time to explore.

Welcome to Traveling With AAA. I'm your host, Mary Herendeen. Today, we are getting out into the open air and talking about adventure here in the U.S.

Joining us is Chez Chesak, executive director of the Outdoor Writers Association of America. Chez is an award-winning adventure travel writer. His articles and photographs have appeared in the Los Angeles Times, Every Day with Rachael Ray, FamilyFun, and Good Housekeeping. He lives here in America's Heartland with his wife, Sally, and 2 teenage daughters. He's an avid skier, biker, and backpacker, and shares his adventures on his website chezconnects.com. Chez Chesak, thank you for joining us today.

Chez Chesak:

My pleasure. Psyched to be here.

Mary:

Thank you! I grew up camping and have always felt a love for being outdoors. Chez, what sparked your love and maybe your passion for the outdoors?

Chez:

I grew up in sort of a rural area of Massachusetts, and it wasn't until years later that I realized my walk to school was essentially a hike. We'd cut through woods and go through these different little areas that wound around a swamp at one point. And as kids often do, you'd stop on the way home to check out the salamanders and things like that, so that was certainly an inspiration.

My dad also had a Volkswagen camper van, and just about every weekend or most summers, we'd get in there and just drive. We’d take these great national road trips to go visit relatives, but we would also go camp in the next town over some weekends. It was just all there around me, and so I think it was natural that I just kind of got into the outdoors.

Mary:

Yeah. Massachusetts and the whole East Coast is just beautiful, especially in the fall. We'll talk about that in a minute, but knowing that you're so active, does your family share your passion?

Chez:

Well, I met my wife working at the American Hiking Society, so she was already there. I think and hope that we instilled a similar passion with our girls because that's so much of what we would do—we'd go on hikes on the weekends or car camping. And we’re trying to get our girls out there with a lot of adventure travel trips and things like that. So, I'm confident they're well skilled in basic outdoor stuff, but I hope we've instilled in them a real lifelong passion, for sure.

Mary:

I'm sure you have. I’m 1 of 8 kids, and we camped a lot as a family, and sometimes like you said just a few towns over. I grew up in Northern California, which also has some of that weather variation, but I'm here in SoCal now, so it's summer or spring all the time. But yeah, that's where I picked it up.

Now, tell us about some of your most memorable outdoor experiences. Can you share with us when, where, or what made it impactful?

Chez:

How long is the show?

Mary:

Well, we've got some time! I'd love to hear.

Chez:

I mean, yeah. So many good ones. During my days at the American Hiking Society, my then girlfriend and now wife, Sally and I went on some volunteer vacations building trails in Sequoia National Forest or Kentucky. I took a NOLS, National Outdoor Leadership School, course and we hiked around the base of Mount Rainier. I think of powder days when I was living in Colorado or Idaho. Backpacking in Yellowstone or when I lived in DC, we'd sometimes get out sea kayaking on the Chesapeake. Many car camping trips with the girls. There are so many good ones. I can't even think of which, if any, would be better because I've probably loved them all.

Mary:

Yeah, it sounds like you've got such variety. And just the way you describe it tells me that you probably had some memorable experiences with all of it. Now, I caught that you said volunteer vacations. Let's go back to that! I'd like to volunteer for a vacation. Can you share with us what you were doing?

Chez:

It's a working vacation. It's a program that the American Hiking Society has had for a very long time, and I'm sure they still do it. But they gathered 8 or 10 volunteers to spend a week building trails. In Sequoia National Forest, we were out in a wilderness area and we would have these trees fall across the trail that we'd have to clear. And you know, it's Sequoia National Forest, so some of these trees would be about 4 or 5 feet across. But it's a wilderness area, so you can't bring anything motorized into it. We’d cut these huge trees apart with a hand saw to clear the trail. Versus in Kentucky, we would spend most of our time cutting steps into some really steep grade trails. You work all day long, but it's a very rewarding experience, for sure.

Mary:

Wow, that's amazing. Now, I know it's important to preserve the beauty of our national parks. Can you share with us a little bit about why that's so important and why there was a program put together for this?

Chez:

Yeah. I mean, it's critical to preserve these places. If we lose it, it's really gone forever. And not only do we risk the possibility of losing a great place to recreate or to center ourselves, but there's a certain amount of biomass that goes into making sure we all get to stay around. If we keep losing these wild places, it's really going to significantly impact how we survive, how we live on this planet, and whether it's very comfortable, very challenging, or if we have that opportunity at all, frankly.

Mary:

Yeah, so whether we want the beauty or not, we've got to preserve it for ourselves.

Chez:

Correct. Mm-hmm.

Mary:

You said growing up in Massachusetts and having the opportunity to hike to school—fall is nearly here. What are your thoughts on outdoor vacations during this time of year?

Chez:

Love it.

Mary:

Tell me more!

Chez:

Winter and fall are probably two of my favorite seasons. And growing up in New England, you have those stunning changes of colors with the foliage and everything. Then you get up in Northern New England, particularly with Vermont, Maine, and New Hampshire—it’s gorgeous. I love it, truly love it.

Colorado is amazing too when you get all those aspens, and they turn that kind of shocking yellow and those beautiful landscapes. It’s amazing. I love the change of the seasons with that little crisp feel to the air knowing that real change is coming. There's generally fewer people out there. Certainly, if you don't have kids, you can go out in the fall while all the families are occupied with school. You can take advantage of that shoulder season. Maybe get some better rates on accommodations and different travel opportunities.

So, yeah, I'm a huge fan, as you can tell.

Mary:

Yeah, that makes sense. Kids are back at school, less people are probably traveling, and you can get the good rates like you said. I'm sure it's also easier to get into some of the national parks with the reservation system, so that makes sense. And it is also beautiful, I will say fall is my favorite time of year as well.

Having been to New England and seeing that foliage—it's insane. It's beautiful. I live here in Southern California, so there's not much change in terms of the weather or trees changing color, but I used to fly into Boston and then drive up to Maine. And so just driving through everything and seeing all the beauty, it's gorgeous. So, thank you for that.

What are some of your best recommendations for autumn hikes if somebody doesn’t get to New England? I know you mentioned Colorado. Anything else? Hikes or walks to see the fall colors?

Chez:

Well, these days I live in the Midwest, and there’s all sorts of great opportunities here. The Hocking Hills area of Ohio has beautiful rolling landscape with great leaves. Not far from West Virginia or Kentucky, which I’m a fan of both. They have stunning landscapes. Michigan is another great place to get out.

In my opinion, New England is that apex of probably the best foliage you might be able to see in the U.S., at least. There’s still plenty of other places we can still get a nice taste of that, and still have a great autumnal experience.

Mary:

It's funny. I was in Kentucky a few years back for work, and because I was so focused on work, I wasn't thinking about the landscape, but Kentucky is beautiful with beautiful trees.

Now, I saw your recent website post on Vegas vacationing. When I think of Vegas, I'm always picturing slot machines, shows, or great food, but would you share a little bit about that with our listeners? What was your take on a Vegas vacation?

Chez:

Yeah, it's just a little bit of a mind shift because a place like Vegas is such a destination, so you’re going to have all sorts of direct flights. You can get some crazy good hotel deals, particularly Sunday through Thursday. And you can utilize that to make it basically a base camp. Then there are all sorts of amazing places right outside Vegas, a quick car trip away both in Nevada and Arizona, where you can get out and have a fantastic outdoor experience. You can hike some of their incredible state parks, getting out to some of the national parks that are nearby. There’s BLM land, a lot of Bureau of Land Management land out there that you can explore. You can leverage that destination and all the access that it has, and really not stay in it. You can also choose to stay in it for a night and have all the fantastic evening events, wonderful accommodations, and great meals but utilize it just to get out of town every day and to go do something completely different.

Mary:

Would you describe for us your most recent Vegas trip in the outdoors?

Chez:

Yeah, we had a fantastic trip. Last December, a group of us went out there. We flew into Vegas and got right out of town pretty quickly. There was some off-road vehicle operators just across the state line in Arizona. Oui Adventures—she's French Canadian, thus O-U-I, if I’m spelling that correctly. They were fantastic. We did Las Vegas glass kayaking with them. They had these plastics see-through kayaks, so you can kind of look through the boat to the water below. Lots of great trekking, hiking, and all sorts of things. And then again, crazy good restaurants, meals, and things like that at night.

Mary:

Wow, thank you. Like I said, I'm always thinking Vegas is more of a party town. And honestly, I really haven't been much since I've had kids. Would you recommend taking little ones on a trip like that? Are there some places that are safe to go, maybe for some younger kids?

Chez:

I always recommend taking kids. Logistically, it's much more challenging, particularly when they're much younger. You're effectively taking care of yourself, but you’re also having to take care of a whole other person or 2 or 3 by managing their packing, food, and all those sorts of things. But boy, the payoff as far as I'm concerned is just fantastic.

When you can get a child out into the outdoors, and they're making their first s’more, or when they're just exploring and seeing tadpoles in a creek and understanding that those are baby frogs. Even when you hear them giggling in the tent while you and your partner are letting the fire die down with a glass of wine in hand. The most amazing things happen. It’s a challenge, but so worth it as far as I’m concerned.

Mary:

My kids love to camp. We've been doing a lot of camping with our travel trailer, usually on state beaches and things like that. So going into Vegas with the kids, and like I said, normally I'm thinking Sin City instead of the beautiful outdoor areas to explore.

Now you mentioned packing. I know you served at the U.S. Army National Guard and spent some time deployed in Iraq. Did you pick up any great habits for packing and meal planning while you were deployed?

Chez:

No.

Mary:

So, you're not one of those roll-your-shirt packers?

Chez:

No, I mean, I think you develop efficiencies and things like that. You develop a tolerance for a whole other level of caring weight on your body. You develop a tolerance for little things that might bother you a lot more after you've been deployed, like blisters, chafing, and things like that. You can really power through, but it's just such a different environment.

In Iraq, I was a machine gunner, so I was stepping off with about 80 pounds to walk around the city we were patrolling. That wasn't any kind of overnight, and I didn't have a full-on backpack with meals for multiple days. That's just going out into town with body armor, the machine gun, bullets, and a camel back that was 80 pounds. So when you're backpacking, and you think, “Boy, this is really heavy.” When you've been deployed, you can always look back and be like, “Ah, this is good. This is fine.”

Mary:

This is OK. I'll carry yours. Right?

Chez:

Yeah.

Mary:

Do your daughters carry their own?

Chez:

As soon as we could.  We instilled in them from a young age having their own little backpack, even if there's really nothing in it so they get used to that concept. And of course, naturally they want to be like the adults, so they're going put something in it like a stuffed animal or something like that. But early on, we got them a backpack so they could feel like, “Oh, I'm packing too.”

The danger there is that you have to be a little careful and check their pack. Our youngest had her book bag on a trip, and we came back home and started going to school. One day I picked it up and it must have weighed about, I don't know, 10 or 15 pounds. I looked in there and it was full of rocks.

Mary:

Oh yes!

Chez:

It was her rock collection, and she just thought she would carry it around with her every day after that.

Mary:

Oh my gosh, I have 2 little rock collectors. They pick them up wherever we go. Usually, I find them in my washing machine.

Chez:

That's a good one, yeah.

Mary:

Need a replacement there, I'm sure.  Now any favorite recipes that you use or meals that you have to have while you're on an adventure?

Chez:

You know, I don't because generally when you're out there burning through some calories, everything tastes good. There's this amazing effect that I've noticed where I'll be out backpacking or something, and I'm eating some kind of energy bar or whatever and I was like, “Oh my God, this is delicious. This is the best thing ever. I'm going eat these all the time.” Then I get home and I'm like, “Oh, it's a bar. This is kind of average,” but out there you're so hungry and craving those calories that everything kind of steps it up a bit.

I actually go for simpler meals or quick and easy stuff. Frankly, a little bit of peanut butter and jelly on a tortilla is brilliant, and I'm completely content with that kind of stuff. So yeah, I don't have any killer recipes or anything yet. We generally stick to a pretty repetitive recipe list just so it's easier to buy those contents. We kind of know what we're getting, we know what we can prep beforehand to make it a little bit easier out there. There's also so many amazing resources online to find great backpacking recipes and things like that.

Mary:

It sounds like it would be a good idea to come up with just a list. Especially when you get there, and you're burning so many calories, everything tastes good. It's probably easier for packing to know, “This takes up this amount of space.” Those high-calorie, high-fat, or carb-bloated foods sound good. I do like the protein bars, and I usually find that I love them the most when I've gone all day without having lunch or something like that. Or if I'm on a trip or burning calories in the gym, I'm like, “These are amazing.” Then when I offer it to someone else, they're like, “What are you thinking? These aren't good.”

Chez:

I mentioned NOLS earlier, the National Outdoor Leadership School, they've got this great model where you have your set breakfast and as they like to say, “And then lunch begins,” because it's all just about snacking through the day. Instead of stopping and having one big meal it’s, “OK, we're going to stop for 15 minutes, grab your bag of trail mix or maybe some hard cheeses, and slice off a couple chunks of a summer sausage, and now we're moving again.” So your lunch is in these increments throughout the day, then of course for dinner you have a full-on meal. I generally follow that model, which I really like, particularly when you're burning through a lot of calories.

Mary:

Yeah, especially if you're doing something active. You can't really stop and have a whole lunch, so you really have to keep fueled.

Chez:

Mm-hmm.

Mary:

Do you have any good recommendations for gear or outdoor equipment? Any favorites that you use?

Chez:

Again, many. I would advise people this though, don't fall into the big box store trap. There are many big box stores that sell some sort of outdoor gear. It's generally going to be really cheap, and you don't know if you're buying the right thing for you. So, really make an effort to get out there to a specialty outdoor retailer—somebody who is focused on selling outdoor equipment. Their sales team will be that much more knowledgeable. They'll be able to talk you through exactly what you need for what you're doing, and find you things that fit your particular body because we're all different, of course. And so I think sometimes there are too many people who are trying to shop by brand and asking, “What's the best?”

Chez:

Well, the best for me may not be the best for you.

Mary:

That makes sense.

Chez:

A great and critical example is footwear. I have some LOWA hiking shoes and boots that I really love. They fit my feet really well, but each manufacturer uses a different model for each brand. So, I might find a brand that fits my foot perfectly, whereas you might also be a guy who tries that same brand and you might have heel problems or something like that just because their model might be slightly off from what your foot is. So you really have to get to those retailers and try on boots and different gear as much as you can. Take your time and be thorough with it. Don't just think, “Oh, I'm going to grab this and now I'm good to go.” Check it out first, find the experts and talk to them.

Mary:

Yeah, that sounds good. Especially going to one of those stores where they specialize and know this equipment.  

Like you said, outdoor shoes, I really fit well in a SOREL. I really like SOREL, and when I try other brands, it's just not as comfortable. It's not the same, and it could be the same size, but it doesn't fit me right. My snow boots are SOREL.

Chez:

Great brand. Absolutely.

Mary:

I really like them. Now, what precautions should people take before setting out on a hike or a biking trip? Is there any safety or comfort tips you would suggest?

Chez:

It really depends on their experience level. If they're brand new to it, maybe take it incrementally. If you're new to hiking, start on some trails at a local park and work your way up to longer trails at a state park. Make sure that the footwear you have works for you, and if it's not, try something else. From there, you might rent a cabin or a platform tent at an adventure resort for a few nights and incrementally going up from there. There are all sorts of different trail clubs and mountain clubs around the country who will teach you a lot of these skills.

So yeah, take it incrementally. Learn about things like the 10 essentials, which a lot of people don't know about. And that’s something you should always have on you whenever you go out into the backcountry. And it’s just some form of navigation be it a map, compass, or GPS; a headlamp or light with extra batteries; sun protection; a first aid kit; a knife just in case; a fire starter. They get into carrying a light shelter, extra food, water, and clothes, which is always a good idea. I know a lot of people aren't ready to go out there and carry an extra tent with them if they're going for a day hike, but just another layer, a shell, a couple extra bars, and always additional water. Keeping those things in mind just in case is key.

Mary:

Yeah, I'd never heard of the 10 essentials so I'm glad you broke it down for us. Now, what about for kids? Any special tips or precautions when taking kids along?

Chez:

Like we were saying earlier, it's just a whole other level of preparation to make sure that they're going to be comfortable and have an enjoyable experience.  Like if they're going to have the foods they want, snacks, and things like that. Always sneak in a couple surprise toys, maybe it's something they haven't played with in a while or something you've kept in reserve. Something that when you bring it out, their eyes are just going to light up.

I will say one specific tip we discovered is that for whatever reason we had kept our girl’s training potty. I think we meant to give it to a cousin who had younger kids, and we just had never done it. At some point, we realized we could take it on camping trips and leave it in the vestibule of our tent. Even though they were big enough that they didn't need a training potty, rather than walking across a campsite, or into the woods they could just pop into the vestibule and use the training potty. And the next morning, we could just dispose of the contents as necessary.

Mary:

Yeah, that's smart. With my little ones, anything that breaks from their routine, they're like, “No, no,” totally against it. Like I said, we have the travel trailer so it has a bathroom inside, but if not, we'd probably need something like that.

Now, what about accessible travel in the outdoors? Are there some places where you can experience it if you're wheelchair-bound or have other physical challenges?

Chez:

Yeah, this is one area that we've probably been negligent as a culture for far too long, but different destinations are getting much better about that in terms of building accessible trails. More and more, manufacturers are making apparatus to get more people who might have a disability further into the backcountry. So we're getting better about it. I’ve got a friend that I know from the travel industry, and he's got a website called Curb Free with Cory Lee. He's in a wheelchair, and nothing slows him down.  

Mary:

Curb Free with Cory Lee?  

Chez:

Exactly. He's amazing. And he has all sorts of suggestions, advice, and tips on places to go. Definitely a site to check out if that's a consideration for you and your family.

Mary:

I love that. It’s also an inspiration, right? Seeing that nothing holds him back, and he is able to go and give those great tips. I think that would be a great place to check out for anybody who’s apprehensive. Thank you for that.

Now, any tips for visiting state, city, or national parks?

Chez:

Yeah, my first thought is you don't always have to go big. We have this incredible system of national parks. We've got Forest Service land, BLM land, and all the state parks. I often see people gravitate to the biggest one or what they think is the best one. This is why so many of our visitors go to a handful of national parks when there's all those other amazing parks out there. I think of Mammoth Cave in Kentucky as an incredible and entirely different experience. It's all cave based, of course. One of the great things about that park is you can go any time of the year because once you get underground, it's always 57 degrees. It could be 110 up top or it could be blowing sleet sideways, but then you get down below and you're a comfortable 57.

Chez:

So yeah, keep an eye out for all those other places. There are numerous national parks that aren't getting that crazy visitation that Yosemite, Yellowstone, and all those big guys are. Consider the entire breadth of your options with state opportunities and city parks. A lot of cities have a fantastic trail or park system counties. Again, the Forest Service and BLM, there's so much out there to explore. Don't always just think of what's the biggest or so-called best, because they're all amazing.

Mary:

Yeah, thank you. Now, based on your adventures, where or what should be on everyone's bucket list for U.S. travel?

Chez:

Oh, you ask tough questions! I say that because again, we live in this fantastically large and diverse country that has all this incredible terrain and topography. There's the Coast of Maine in contrast to the Florida Keys. Alaska is stunning and huge. Then we have the coast of California—there's so many great places. You've got really unique things like the Craters of the Moon National Monument in Idaho. The list just goes on and on and on.

In terms of where to go, there's just so many great options. And to take it to the next level, not only do we have this big, amazing diverse country, but we've got 2 other big, amazing diverse countries that neighbor us. So, get up to The Maritimes and Nova Scotia, Alberta, and some of those provinces out there in Canada. It’s stunning, stunning, stunning. It takes the U.S. Rocky Mountains, which are already incredible, and maybe takes it up a notch or even further. So yeah, I could ramble on about that for a long time.

Mary:

I could see your face! You're smiling. I stumped you with that one question about the bucket list, and it sounds like you're saying if there was anything to check off the list, it would be just to experience and get out there as much as you can. Soak up what the U.S. and our neighboring countries have to offer.

Chez:

It's all there, just go. Get out.

Mary:

Yeah, thank you. Now, Chez Chesak, I just want to say thank you so much for joining us today, being with us and sharing your experiences.

Chez:

My pleasure. Thanks for the opportunity.

Mary:

Yeah, and thank you. Thank you to our listeners for being with us. If you're planning a trip, be sure to connect with a AAA travel advisor, check out aaa.com/travel, or visit your local branch. And if you enjoyed this podcast, please subscribe. I'm Mary Herendeen. Thank you for traveling with AAA.